First, keeping your base up is a game of information. The more information you have, the higher the chance you can utilize that information to keep your base from going down. This information can come from a few places.
1) Your team. They tell you where the enemy threats are.
2) The sensor net. Use your command screen. Its amazingly valuable. I can't stress this enough.
3) Angles. Don't move into locations you are unsure of. Utilize your look options and see things around corners. This is very important. HO Shield vs HD Shield dueling is a game of quick draw. Often times the one that gets off first is the victor.
Major weapons are -> Mine disks, Chaingun, Grenade launcher spam, Long range mortar, Body blocks
Minor weapons are -> Plasma rifle spam, Missile Launcher, Shocklance, Conc nades.
Don't try to be creative unless you are really good at the basics. The best HD will be able to beat your offense down and expand the defense as well. On my team I've been known to play many roles while still being labeled "the HD", even offensive ones. HD is a cerebral position and there is lots of room for creativity and it can be used to showcase versatility.
Basic techniques include:
1) Using the shield pack correctly. Dont leave it on. Pulse it to avoid incoming damage at the last moment.
2) Picking the right positions. Understanding which areas are most safe is the most important part a lot of the time.
3) Its complicated. To seriously play HD you need to think about so much that even the above average player doesnt think about in competitive matches. You need to understand how best to protect your objective. Sometimes that includes letting the objective go down, in order to destroy the enemy. Its a game of risk calculation. Its risky to leave and repair a turret, but you might get a huge reward off of it. Its risky to drop down to the lower floor, but you might get the duel over with faster and be able to repair quickly before the other HO comes in. So you need to decide and gamble on it.
4) Its a race. Doing things vs Time is what is going to bring your team an advantage. If your HD can clear out their HO faster, you will rape their base. It affects all positions. Complicated HD strategies exist that are focused on bating an enemy to waste their time. These are most valuable in competition.
5) Pack juggle. Its the most important thing above all else.
6) Start to be creative. You have no idea what a sandbox this position is. Develop a strategy which end point includes a major impact on the entire game. Often times I'll lose a base because I don't know how to play on that particular map yet. But in general, there is always a way. You just need to find out the best one.
mostly shrike defence with good light defence/heavy defence using shocklance. satchels mines etc all the usual stuff. lights can get up and going if you have your 5 mobile invs set up at the start of a game so if you get all 5 up in the first 30 sec your flag defence can always equip.
pull people back from other positions if you need to clear the base but try not to take too much from your offence. the best defence is a good offence. adapt and have inteligent players that know what to do at any given time. practice.
but mostly the best way is to be ready, have 1-2 more people on defence at the starts of a match when you know they send more offence. take a capper and light offence to do this maybe. break them and push more people into offence and keep the pressure on. prevention rather than cure.
don't forget that the blaster ignores sheilds so if you get a base full of sheild pack heavies ping away. and always nade(g key) hand grenade. don't leave any of the three your equiped with at spawn for the enemy to pick up. grenade grenade grenade.
Sometime's you have to fight fire with fire. Unless you have really good LD, organized D and/or maybe a group teaming up to protect the gens, you may have to try and match up their HO with HO. Slow them down trying to HO back. Slow their momentum and increase yours.
I play heavy offense quite a bit and camp the enemy base with a shield pack. The thing that annoys me most with this are people who come at me with blasters. If they use any other weapon, chances are I will kill them before they even get through my shield. Blaster on the other hand, doesn't have to worry about that. Every blaster shot brings me a little closer to death. So long as you make sure I'm not getting repair kits to regain the lost health, constantly respawning and shooting me with a blaster is guaranteed to kill me eventually - probably faster than any other method available to you if you can't get a loadout. But keep in mind, even after you kill me, if my base is up, I will be back in very short order. So, your team needs to expend some effort in keeping my base down, or else the HO train will simply continue.
Would you say blaster over ELF/(mine disc/plasma/cg)?
a couple points:
you shouldn't be using elf at all, blaster would be a lot better. If you can suit up and get an elf though, you might as well suit up in light shield and try to mine disc/nade them while you're at it. mine disc and nades are generally the best way to clear ho out of a base.
try to toss your health kit before you go into retake the base. it helps the campers more than it helps you.
For the record, i disagree with kryand on a couple of things: about the blaster, i'll only use it if they're low on health, but i typically just spam hand nades and discs. Secondly, i don't think the defense generally should be the ones helping retake the base, and i don't think you really want the offense getting back on offense as soon as possible in many circumstances. the defense, particularly the ld, should not be wasting time trying to retake their base; they should be watching the flag. The HO for your team, when they die, should usually try to help your hd/farmers bring the gen back up. while i understand the feeling of urgency to quickly head out to offense, lest the other team bring even more pressure, usually it's counterproductive, as on many maps, a team of ill-equipped lights (or worse yet, lights in spawn) will get chewed up by laser rifles and turrets. If they are consistently holding the gens for periods of time while your offense is struggling to stay alive on their side of the field, it unfortunately is usually a result of being just outclassed (or terribly uncoordinated with the rest of your team). better ho will simply stay alive a lot longer and will be a lot more consistent and effective at keeping a base down, and likewise, a bad hd will let them in and allow them to camp it far more often
i would be more prone to agreeing with proj on the state of who helps get the defense up, however from a ho perspective i think sometimes the easiest and hardest part of raping can start with a route, u take a ho off a route (conc nade and elf defense) can really put a damper on raping consistently, especially if they are really good at it. not really good for interior fighting tho. this game is, in a nutshell, a game of endurance vs persistence. ur defense needs to be enduring, so that ur offense can be persistent. higher up in the game sometimes its all about who breaks first.
Raping the enemy base is fun, but raping without capping the enemy flag is useless. I've seen too many maps in pubs where the rape train lost, because the other team played the flag!
Didn't Popguns & Poosies do a song called Rapetrain?
I'm on the rapetrain
Bottoms up
I'm on the rapetrain
Fill my boost
I'm on the rapehtrain
Ready to crash and burn
They'll never learn
I'm on the rapetrain
I love that stuff
I'm on the rapetrain
I can never get enough
I'm on the rapetrain
Gonna to return - yeah
iwannawhineawhineawhine
rapetrainnnnnnnn ooooh!
I play defense a lot and I've been playing since the first tribes so here I go. I usually have a medium armor load out that doubles as defense and engie or repair guy whatever you want to call me. My load out is a good balance of inside and outside defense: I have blaster(good for corner shots and a rapid fire weapon that can surpass shields), chaingun (obvious reasons), ELF (is great for stopping something before it starts usually you'll want to use it outside and hope someone can come and help while the guy is more or less trapped on the ground), and missile launcher (shooting down bombers and other airborne threats), normal or concussion grenades are nice more so concussion since it makes them drop their weapon and great to buy you some time, mines, repair pack ( heal your base and self if needed). I always go for sensors before turrets because the turrets basically have no range other than right in front of them without sensors.... I hope this helps if anyone has something to add to this I'm open to suggestions.
Oddly enough, you can. It was easy, too. All it took was a shield pack and an ELF cannon. They blow themselves up when you drain their shields.
Think about it. Someone waltzes into a base thinking "I'm INVINCIBLE BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA" and they activate their shield and spam mortars all over the place. Even around themselves. Drain their shields and the aforementioned thought becomes "bwahahahahahahaOSHI-"
Wow. There is no feeling like making someone commit suicide. I don't care that I don't get the points for killing them. It makes them look like noobs and makes you look like you know what you're doing, which is perfect for me
Admittedly, this relies on two major things. ONE: you're ready for them with the loadout (Juggernaut prefered) and TWO: you're in an enclosed environment. And it might be a good idea to have other people out there who take some health off of them before they get in. Remember, BLASTERS ARE YOUR FRIEND. And so are ELFs!
Oddly enough, you can. It was easy, too. All it took was a shield pack and an ELF cannon. They blow themselves up when you drain their shields.
Think about it. Someone waltzes into a base thinking "I'm INVINCIBLE BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA" and they activate their shield and spam mortars all over the place. Even around themselves. Drain their shields and the aforementioned thought becomes "bwahahahahahahaOSHI-"
Wow. There is no feeling like making someone commit suicide. I don't care that I don't get the points for killing them. It makes them look like noobs and makes you look like you know what you're doing, which is perfect for me
Admittedly, this relies on two major things. ONE: you're ready for them with the loadout (Juggernaut prefered) and TWO: you're in an enclosed environment. And it might be a good idea to have other people out there who take some health off of them before they get in. Remember, BLASTERS ARE YOUR FRIEND. And so are ELFs!
Derailing a single car doesn't stop the rape train - it still smashes into you.
Oddly enough, you can. It was easy, too. All it took was a shield pack and an ELF cannon. They blow themselves up when you drain their shields.
Think about it. Someone waltzes into a base thinking "I'm INVINCIBLE BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA" and they activate their shield and spam mortars all over the place. Even around themselves. Drain their shields and the aforementioned thought becomes "bwahahahahahahaOSHI-"
Wow. There is no feeling like making someone commit suicide. I don't care that I don't get the points for killing them. It makes them look like noobs and makes you look like you know what you're doing, which is perfect for me
Admittedly, this relies on two major things. ONE: you're ready for them with the loadout (Juggernaut prefered) and TWO: you're in an enclosed environment. And it might be a good idea to have other people out there who take some health off of them before they get in. Remember, BLASTERS ARE YOUR FRIEND. And so are ELFs!
Derailing a single car doesn't stop the rape train - it still smashes into you.
Have you ever even SEEN a train? Do you know what happens when you derail ONE CAR???
Anyway, after recovering from your unrealistic stupidity, I came up with this: Just do the same thing to everyone else in the train. If there's two heavies defending, one with a rep pack, you really can't keep the base down very long. Also, smart defenders usually keep an inventory station nearby, out of mortar blast area.
The situation becomes "Bwahahaha I just raped your base" *dead* "Haha, I'll jet over there and HOLY JESU-" raped by fourteen plasma rifles
And if derailing a single car doesn't stop the train, tell that to the people on Goons. They haven't figured that out.
Have you ever seen a train wreck? Everything in front of the spot where a car derailed is still completely smashed. Thanks for player - sorry you lose.
Have you ever seen a train wreck? Everything in front of the spot where a car derailed is still completely smashed. Thanks for player - sorry you lose.
THIS RAPE TRAIN HAS NO BRAKES!
Dude: You've just derialed the first few cars of a train. I don't think you'll have any problems dealing with the only two or three cars that will actually hit you at that point.
Assuming you want to keep the metaphor going: Your sensors and turrets are trashed, and maybe even your vehicle bay, but your generator's fine.
And the cool thing is, after pulling this off for awhile, they give up how cool is that?
rape means they dont want to play, they just want to win by keeping you from the invos
Vat a tvist! Didn't really think about it like that. I guess it's ok if they do it once or twice during a critical point in the game and plan it out... Not constant stuff from one guy...
Your gens, your invs, your turrets and deployables, even your naked spawns - they are all going boom. You can't stop it.
And I've noticed that we've gotten off course from the original topic. Best way is probably to ignore it as much as you can, but be ready to repair stuff soon. If the base is down for awhile and nobody can go in and find anything to destroy, they get bored and leave. Unless you're as single-minded as Teratos is proving to be, in which case you'll only have one rapist to deal with for most of the rest of the map. See above for dealing with that.
Three or four guys tried to defend their base from the inside and two from the outside tonight. Do you know what that got them?
A mortar to the face.
I come bearing gifts of RAPE RAPE RAPE.
They kinda suck at this, then. I've consistently defended from two juggies at a time. It's the scouts with shield packs and plasma rifles that annoy me. And if they come at the same time, then it's not a rape train, this requires different tactics.
I had something like 560 points raping gens today.
I come bearing gifts of RAPE RAPE RAPE!
That was without help from teammates (in the gen room). You just can't defend it.
I find it astounding that everything I've said about you is being proven true in this one post.
Gen rooms seem surprisingly easy to defend if you know what you're doing. Get a few motion sensors and keep the person from getting to the room in the first place. Blasters against the shield guys, plasmas for all else. Actually, plasmas are surprisingly effective against shields, mostly for their fast fire rate and decent damage. Oh, and... grenade launchers, I guess...
I refuted your baseless assertions with cold, hard facts. If four guys inside and a half dozen outside (with turrets) couldn't defend the gens, why do you think you would be able to keep me out?
I refuted your baseless assertions with cold, hard facts. If four guys inside and a half dozen outside (with turrets) couldn't defend the gens, why do you think you would be able to keep me out?
You have no chance.
make your time
I was talking about you being single minded and obsessive. What were YOU talking about?
I refuted your baseless assertions with cold, hard facts. If four guys inside and a half dozen outside (with turrets) couldn't defend the gens, why do you think you would be able to keep me out?
You have no chance.
make your time
I was talking about you being single minded and obsessive. What were YOU talking about?
I'm glad to see that you finally admitted that the rape train cannot be stopped.
Am I single-minded? Maybe if you mean I want to win.
Typically I rape gens and return flags, but I occasionally make grabs (mostly e-grabs) or just go kill people in light armor or HoF.
Comments
Blatant lie. I'm reporting you to the moderators.
First, keeping your base up is a game of information. The more information you have, the higher the chance you can utilize that information to keep your base from going down. This information can come from a few places.
1) Your team. They tell you where the enemy threats are.
2) The sensor net. Use your command screen. Its amazingly valuable. I can't stress this enough.
3) Angles. Don't move into locations you are unsure of. Utilize your look options and see things around corners. This is very important. HO Shield vs HD Shield dueling is a game of quick draw. Often times the one that gets off first is the victor.
Major weapons are -> Mine disks, Chaingun, Grenade launcher spam, Long range mortar, Body blocks
Minor weapons are -> Plasma rifle spam, Missile Launcher, Shocklance, Conc nades.
Don't try to be creative unless you are really good at the basics. The best HD will be able to beat your offense down and expand the defense as well. On my team I've been known to play many roles while still being labeled "the HD", even offensive ones. HD is a cerebral position and there is lots of room for creativity and it can be used to showcase versatility.
Basic techniques include:
1) Using the shield pack correctly. Dont leave it on. Pulse it to avoid incoming damage at the last moment.
2) Picking the right positions. Understanding which areas are most safe is the most important part a lot of the time.
3) Its complicated. To seriously play HD you need to think about so much that even the above average player doesnt think about in competitive matches. You need to understand how best to protect your objective. Sometimes that includes letting the objective go down, in order to destroy the enemy. Its a game of risk calculation. Its risky to leave and repair a turret, but you might get a huge reward off of it. Its risky to drop down to the lower floor, but you might get the duel over with faster and be able to repair quickly before the other HO comes in. So you need to decide and gamble on it.
4) Its a race. Doing things vs Time is what is going to bring your team an advantage. If your HD can clear out their HO faster, you will rape their base. It affects all positions. Complicated HD strategies exist that are focused on bating an enemy to waste their time. These are most valuable in competition.
5) Pack juggle. Its the most important thing above all else.
6) Start to be creative. You have no idea what a sandbox this position is. Develop a strategy which end point includes a major impact on the entire game. Often times I'll lose a base because I don't know how to play on that particular map yet. But in general, there is always a way. You just need to find out the best one.
pull people back from other positions if you need to clear the base but try not to take too much from your offence. the best defence is a good offence. adapt and have inteligent players that know what to do at any given time. practice.
but mostly the best way is to be ready, have 1-2 more people on defence at the starts of a match when you know they send more offence. take a capper and light offence to do this maybe. break them and push more people into offence and keep the pressure on. prevention rather than cure.
don't forget that the blaster ignores sheilds so if you get a base full of sheild pack heavies ping away. and always nade(g key) hand grenade. don't leave any of the three your equiped with at spawn for the enemy to pick up. grenade grenade grenade.
i would be more prone to agreeing with proj on the state of who helps get the defense up, however from a ho perspective i think sometimes the easiest and hardest part of raping can start with a route, u take a ho off a route (conc nade and elf defense) can really put a damper on raping consistently, especially if they are really good at it. not really good for interior fighting tho. this game is, in a nutshell, a game of endurance vs persistence. ur defense needs to be enduring, so that ur offense can be persistent. higher up in the game sometimes its all about who breaks first.
you can adapt and persevere, or you can whine that it's cheap
ps raping is a lot of fun if you're good at it. and it can be a challenge, too, against a good team.
I'm on the rapetrain
Bottoms up
I'm on the rapetrain
Fill my boost
I'm on the rapehtrain
Ready to crash and burn
They'll never learn
I'm on the rapetrain
I love that stuff
I'm on the rapetrain
I can never get enough
I'm on the rapetrain
Gonna to return - yeah
iwannawhineawhineawhine
rapetrainnnnnnnn ooooh!
with no appologies to axel
Oddly enough, you can. It was easy, too. All it took was a shield pack and an ELF cannon. They blow themselves up when you drain their shields.
Think about it. Someone waltzes into a base thinking "I'm INVINCIBLE BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA" and they activate their shield and spam mortars all over the place. Even around themselves. Drain their shields and the aforementioned thought becomes "bwahahahahahahaOSHI-"
Wow. There is no feeling like making someone commit suicide. I don't care that I don't get the points for killing them. It makes them look like noobs and makes you look like you know what you're doing, which is perfect for me
Admittedly, this relies on two major things. ONE: you're ready for them with the loadout (Juggernaut prefered) and TWO: you're in an enclosed environment. And it might be a good idea to have other people out there who take some health off of them before they get in. Remember, BLASTERS ARE YOUR FRIEND. And so are ELFs!
Have you ever even SEEN a train? Do you know what happens when you derail ONE CAR???
Anyway, after recovering from your unrealistic stupidity, I came up with this: Just do the same thing to everyone else in the train. If there's two heavies defending, one with a rep pack, you really can't keep the base down very long. Also, smart defenders usually keep an inventory station nearby, out of mortar blast area.
The situation becomes "Bwahahaha I just raped your base" *dead* "Haha, I'll jet over there and HOLY JESU-" raped by fourteen plasma rifles
And if derailing a single car doesn't stop the train, tell that to the people on Goons. They haven't figured that out.
Have you ever seen a train wreck? Everything in front of the spot where a car derailed is still completely smashed. Thanks for player - sorry you lose.
THIS RAPE TRAIN HAS NO BRAKES!
Dude: You've just derialed the first few cars of a train. I don't think you'll have any problems dealing with the only two or three cars that will actually hit you at that point.
Assuming you want to keep the metaphor going: Your sensors and turrets are trashed, and maybe even your vehicle bay, but your generator's fine.
And the cool thing is, after pulling this off for awhile, they give up
A mortar to the face.
I come bearing gifts of RAPE RAPE RAPE.
Vat a tvist! Didn't really think about it like that. I guess it's ok if they do it once or twice during a critical point in the game and plan it out... Not constant stuff from one guy...
And I've noticed that we've gotten off course from the original topic. Best way is probably to ignore it as much as you can, but be ready to repair stuff soon. If the base is down for awhile and nobody can go in and find anything to destroy, they get bored and leave. Unless you're as single-minded as Teratos is proving to be, in which case you'll only have one rapist to deal with for most of the rest of the map. See above for dealing with that.
They kinda suck at this, then. I've consistently defended from two juggies at a time. It's the scouts with shield packs and plasma rifles that annoy me. And if they come at the same time, then it's not a rape train, this requires different tactics.
I come bearing gifts of RAPE RAPE RAPE!
That was without help from teammates (in the gen room). You just can't defend it.
I find it astounding that everything I've said about you is being proven true in this one post.
Gen rooms seem surprisingly easy to defend if you know what you're doing. Get a few motion sensors and keep the person from getting to the room in the first place. Blasters against the shield guys, plasmas for all else. Actually, plasmas are surprisingly effective against shields, mostly for their fast fire rate and decent damage. Oh, and... grenade launchers, I guess...
You have no chance.
make your time
I was talking about you being single minded and obsessive. What were YOU talking about?
I'm glad to see that you finally admitted that the rape train cannot be stopped.
Am I single-minded? Maybe if you mean I want to win.
Typically I rape gens and return flags, but I occasionally make grabs (mostly e-grabs) or just go kill people in light armor or HoF.
It appears I must go back to the original quote. With a forum rule.
THOU SHALT KNOW THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN FACT AND OPINION